How To Repair Ladder Attachment On Rv Side

Topic: Replacing Ladder Mounts

Posted By: tkcas01 on 06/16/x 09:27am I am curious if anyone has e'er replaced the mounting pads on their roof ladder. From the image, yous tin see my event. I am in touch on with the ladder manufacturer to come across about getting replacement parts. My question for the forum is regarding the removal/replacement. As you can see these are riveted on. Should it be relatively straightforward to drill out the rivets and replace with screws of the appropriate size?

[image]

Roaming Full Timer

Posted By: kampinguru on 06/16/10 09:49am I would do the rivets one at a fourth dimension in case there is a bankroll plate on the inside. If y'all drill out all four rivets at one time, information technology could fall off. I would get some aluminum rivets and re-rivet it rather than trying to utilize screws. A pop rivet gun kit is not very expensive.

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Posted By: robatthelake on 06/16/10 ten:40am There Is No Mode that Yous can Drill and Supervene upon those Rivets One at a Time. How would You install the New Mounting Hardware?

In All Likelihood in that location is a Strip of Metal ,rather than a Plate embedded in the Rear Cap , there may exist Nothing except Fiberglas ,so the chance of something dropping Out is unlikely. After all Not all Ladders are Installed in the exact same spot or even attached at the Manufacturing Found.

Judging by the Way that the Centre Mounting Point has rusted I would be Checking All the Other Attachment Points on that Ladder.

Rob & Jean
98 Dutch Star Diesel Pusher ..07 Honda CRV AWD

Posted Past: cmartin7143 on 06/16/10 x:49am Im no wiz kid. but why are they so eaten upward? My guess would be dis simalar metals causing galvanic reaction. Or they were covered by something that held water on them. But an thought. Good luck!

Posted By: tkcas01 on 06/16/x 11:17am

cmartin7143 wrote:

Im no wiz kid. but why are they so eaten up? My gauge would exist dis simalar metals causing galvanic reaction. Or they were covered by something that held water on them. Just an idea. Proficient luck!

Good question! They are a mess to be on a 2004 coach. These are the lesser mounts - there are four more upward higher on the ladder and they accept non failed similar this.

Posted By: tkcas01 on 06/sixteen/ten 10:01am

kampinguru wrote:

I would practise the rivets ane at a time in case there is a backing plate on the within.

Thank you. That is an excellent thought, but and so that made me realize that if I open the rear doors where you access coolant and fluid reservoirs, I have access to the area behind where these are fastened. What is interesting is there is nothing back there but fiberglass, so it seems in that location probably is a plate in there, but it is patently sandwiched betwixt layers of fiberglass.

You tin't fifty-fifty encounter the backside of the rivets, so it seems they attached the mounting hardware and so practical fiberglass to the backside of the rear cap - which seems odd. That ways the back part of the rivets will stay sandwiched in the fiberglass. I guess I should try to get a recommendation from Monaco.

Posted Past: tkcas01 on 06/16/x 11:38am OP UPDATE!

Well, I got a response from Monaco, but all they offered were pictures of a mount on a new ladder they must have in stock. While this mount is of a dissimilar pattern, it looks like the mounting plate but has a bolt that sticks through from the back. If that is the case, information technology seems I simply need to take the plate off and replace the bolt and whatever other parts rusted away. If you await at the parts diagram Atwood sent to me, it looks like there was probably a "barb connector" secured betwixt 2 nuts on the bolt.

Still the question remains - what are these rivets secured to since from behind I cannot see the backside of the rivets, and therefore am I able to re-rivet or do I have to drill through and use bolts to secure?

I'll report dorsum when I hear from Atwood in what parts they accept as replacements.

[image]

Posted Past: Dutch_12078 on 06/16/10 11:57am The nut that's pressed inside the tubing is chosen a "star nut", and can be establish at nearly bike repair shops. The same nut is used in threadless headstocks on bikes. They come in a few different sizes, and so measure out the tubing ID before buying.

Star nut

[image]

Dutch
2001 GBM Landau 34' Course A
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Posted By: Chris Bryant on 06/16/ten 01:36pm

Dutch_12078 wrote:

The nut that's pressed within the tubing is called a "star nut", and can be constitute at about bicycle repair shops. The same nut is used in threadless headstocks on bikes. They come in a few different sizes, so measure the tubing ID before ownership.

Star nut

[image]

Thank you, thank yous, give thanks you [emoticon] . I've been searching for that item for years, without knowing what to phone call it.

To the OP- they most likely used bulb type popular rivets, which split to look like toggle bolts.

-- Chris Bryant

Posted By: Dutch_12078 on 06/xvi/10 02:48pm

Chris Bryant wrote:

Dutch_12078 wrote:

The nut that'southward pressed inside the tubing is called a "star nut", and can exist plant at nigh cycle repair shops. The same nut is used in threadless headstocks on bikes. They come up in a few unlike sizes, and so measure the tubing ID earlier buying.

Star nut

Thank y'all, give thanks you, thank you [emoticon] . I've been searching for that item for years, without knowing what to call it.

Glad to help, Chris! Maybe that's a tiny bit of payback for all the manuals I've "borrowed" from your website. [emoticon]

Dutch

Posted By: tkcas01 on 06/xvi/10 03:58pm MORE from OP

Wow. What initially seemed mayhap a simple prepare is suddenly seeming complicated. Not clear that the "star nut" mentioned above is the same as the "barb connector" shown on the ladder manufacturer parts diagram, provided as a link in an earlier post.

Assuming the star nut is the way to go, I am wondering what the repair steps would be? Based on what I have learned and then far, I am thinking the steps might be:

Cut off what remains of protruding bolts.
Drill out rivets.
Remove plate and residue of bolt.
Insert new bolt through back of plate.
Thread a nut on the bolt, to within about three/4" of the plate.
Place the star nut on the bolt. (assume the convex of the star nut faces outward)
Back up the star nut with a locking nut (?).
Insert this associates into the stop of the ladder rail.
From the back-side of the plate, tighten the bolt to lock the star nut in place.
With the mounting plate firmly attached to the ladder rail, re-attach the plate to the rig (still not sure if re-riveting is an option based on the manner the rear cease cap was manufactured.

Thoughts? Suggestions?

PS:

I am asking for detailed steps because an alternative would be to assemble the plate, bolt, star nut and "positioning" basics, remount this assembly on the rig then shove the ladder rails over the mounted assembly. Just non articulate if I attach the mounting hardware first to the ladder, or start to the rig...

* This post was edited 06/16/10 04:05pm past tkcas01 *

Posted By: Dutch_12078 on 06/xvi/ten 04:41pm Drill out the rivets and remove the mounting plate.

Cut off the rusted bolt and nut.

Employ a new bolt to drive the star nut into the tubing about 1/two" to 3/iv", with the spring curve towards the open terminate. At that place are variations amid brands, so the nut in the parts book may look slightly unlike, merely they all work the same. (On edit; I just checked the parts link, and it looks similar Atwood may have used a single spring star nut. The double one will hold up much better.)

Adhere the mounting plate to the tubing with the new bolt, using Loctite on the threads to secure it. Make certain the mounting holes are aligned with the rivet holes in the wall.

Pop rivet or bolt the mounting plate back in place.

For a final step, I'd suggest drilling a pocket-sized (three/sixteen") hole in the bottom of the tubing, but clear of the mounting plate, to allow any future moisture to drain.

Dutch

Posted By: tkcas01 on 06/xvi/x 05:01pm

Dutch_12078 wrote:

?For a final step, I'd advise drilling a pocket-size (3/16") pigsty in the bottom of the tubing, just clear of the mounting plate, to let any future moisture to drain.
Dutch

EX-ACTLY!!

In pondering the failure, I as well arrived at this conclusion - that h2o/moisture found its way into the ladder railing and gathered in the lower end, leading to the corrosion. That explains why the upper mounts have not failed. So in reality this was a blueprint flaw that did not provide for drainage of moisture in the railing.

Posted Past: Dutch_12078 on 06/16/10 08:17pm

tkcas01 wrote:

Dutch_12078 wrote:

?For a final step, I'd propose drilling a small (3/xvi") pigsty in the lesser of the tubing, merely clear of the mounting plate, to permit any hereafter wet to drain.
Dutch

EX-ACTLY!!

In pondering the failure, I also arrived at this decision - that water/moisture plant its way into the ladder railing and gathered in the lower end, leading to the corrosion. That explains why the upper mounts have non failed. And then in reality this was a pattern flaw that did not provide for drainage of moisture in the railing.

Yeah, I've seen plenty of them rust out like yours that I put punching holes in the tubing on my "ToDo" list every time I buy another rig with a ladder. [emoticon]

Dutch

Posted By: 2EZ2 RUN on 06/17/10 03:55am I did not provide an get out for wet at the bottom of the ladder - adept idea & volition do.

What I did was to paint the new star nut with Rustoleum and replace the ferrous machine spiral belongings the mounting plate to the tubing with a stainless steel machine screw. The SS machine screw is non as stiff as the ferrous one but well able to handle this type of load.

Andy

Andy
New 2 RVing
1994 30' Cobra Passport on E350 chassis

Posted By: kneal44 on 06/17/10 09:16am i had a couple broken supports. i dident know what star nuts were so i used all thread rod and several nuts and lock nuts... done ii years agone and still going stiff.

be careful when u tightgen to ladder so every bit not to beat the upright aluminum tubing. tighten with regular nut and lock with lock nut.

when u play in the sand .... y'all can go stuck

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Posted Past: Triker33 on 06/17/10 10:44am Not real inexpensive. Simply I replaced my lesser brackets.
With i" SS 90 degree Rectangular Base
I replaced the rivets with SS screws. Afterwards a couple years they are notwithstanding belongings.

Larry Total Time Since 99
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Posted By: bill h on 06/17/10 02:54pm .

The problem is moisture and dissimilar metals corroding.

[image]

I could not find star nuts of the right size, anyhow, and then I made threaded inserts of aluminum bar stock and reassembled with stainless bolts.

[image]

Retaining screw:

[image]

And added drain holes. Once a year, I shoot a footling LPS-3 up each hole.

* This post was edited 06/18/x 04:58pm by bill h *

NOTE: Any incorrect spelling is intentional to prevent those annoying popups.

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Posted Past: acker1 on 06/17/x ten:54pm I'g getting ready to do the same to mine. I did the removable function of the ladder last yr. I found that I might have to take the ladder completely off in guild to properly insert the 'star nuts'. They don't become in like shooting fish in a barrel. Non enough room to work on information technology between ladder tube and rear of MH.
DICK

40' 2010 Phaeton QTH
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Posted By: LarryJM on 06/xix/10 03:26am

Dutch_12078 wrote:

For a final step, I'd suggest drilling a small (iii/xvi") hole in the bottom of the tubing, just clear of the mounting plate, to let any hereafter moisture to bleed.

Dutch

Thanks, never considered that ... but seems like a great suggestion and something on my "TO Exercise" list for today.

I suggestion I might add is to take one of the plastic margarine tubs and experiment with what size hole gives you the drainage you want since at some point the hole is modest enough that surface tension and lack of h2o head pressure level will preclude draining the water below a certain level.

Larry

2001 standard box seven.3L E-350 PSD Van with four.10 rear and 2007 Holiday Rambler Aluma-Lite 8306S Been RV'ing since 1974.
RAINKAP INSTALL////ETERNABOND INSTALL

Posted By: tkcas01 on 06/nineteen/10 11:40am More from OP

I was checking the ladder more closely and found that it is Non merely the lower mounts that are failing in this way. I of the mounts a bit higher up is besides failing, and so I guess I will get ahead and replace them all. Sounds like fun. [emoticon]

Posted By: Dutch_12078 on 06/19/ten 12:42pm

tkcas01 wrote:

More from OP

I was checking the ladder more closely and found that information technology is NOT just the lower mounts that are failing in this way. One of the mounts a scrap higher upwardly is also failing, so I guess I will get ahead and supercede them all. Sounds like fun. [emoticon]

Bummer!

Dutch

Posted By: tkcas01 on 07/18/10 01:10pm More from OP

Well, finally got the parts I needed from Atwood. Finally got up the nerve to starting time the process.

The caput of the rivets came off easy enough, so I have a couple of the plates off. I'm non sure what kind of rivets these are, being hollow, but in one case I got the head off I was able to start employ a small flake to drill through to the back. Then used a chip just smaller than the shaft of the rivet to further weaken it and get the shaft out the back.

[image]

Posted By: tkcas01 on 07/18/10 04:24pm More than from OP

Thought I would add some other photo. This is looking into 1 of the horizontal back up tubes, where the ladder attaches to information technology. The star basics on this i had not totally disintegrated equally some of the others had, but y'all tin can see they are on their style.

For those of you drill drain holes and spraying lube into the voids, realize that on the mid-ladder horizontal supports that there is a star nut on each finish! This i nonetheless seems solid, so non certain if I should leave well enough lone or try to become it out and supercede.

[image]

Posted By: blackf3504dr on 04/03/xi 06:22am I realize this is an old thread but was glad I plant it as I have run into the aforementioned problem. Now I know how to fix it ! Thanks guys.

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Posted By: kneal44 on 04/05/11 02:11pm you can purchas star nuts on ebay and most bycicle shops. got my last two at a bikeshop for $2each with stainless allen head bolt.

to become one-time rusty star nut out i used a socket and hammer to break loose and then a neddle nose to pull out. lots of rusty crud had to be removed.

then spray with silicone and drill bleed hole as advised before.

Posted By: kneal44 on 04/05/xi 02:44pm i simply checked mcmaster carr supply and they take 7/8 tubing star nuts 10 pack for $viii.72 plus aircraft.

Posted By: tkcas01 on 04/05/11 07:23pm

blackf3504dr wrote:

I realize this is an sometime thread simply was glad I found information technology as I have encounter the aforementioned problem. Now I know how to gear up it ! Thanks guys.

Glad to be able to assistance!

More from OP

And I simply realized that I didn't tell the end of the story. Since I didn't totally remove the ladder to do the repair, getting the star nuts into the lower stop of the ladder was a bit tricky. Getting them into the upper supports was non an issue since they came off the rig. I used a socket, nut and washer as a makeshift tool for tapping them in.

[image]

As you tin see, they practice shrink quite a fleck, and then it does have some effort and you want to make certain it goes in direct.

[image]

However, since the ladder was still attached to the roof of the rig and I could not get plenty clearance at the bottom to drive in the nuts, I turned things around a bit. I temporarily installed 1 of the lower mounts, again using a socket as spacer and fill-in to the star nut. I was so able to position the end of the ladder over each star nut and force it into place with a little heave-ho.

[image]

With the star nuts in place, I then secured the lower mounts to the ladder and was able to attach them back to the rig. Since the lower mounts take most of the load, I had aluminum backing plates fabricated for the behind of the fiberglass and used stainless nuts and bolts to secure them. On the college ones that I could not reach from the back, I just used stainless screws a flake bigger than the rivets that I drilled out. It'south all very solid now.

* This post was last edited 04/05/11 07:53pm past tkcas01 *

Posted By: blackf3504dr on 04/06/11 04:38am tkcas01, thanks for the update. I accept the lower office of the ladder off and take one mountain at the acme I need to address. I may buy a few actress star basics to accept on hand for future repairs ...

Posted Past: blackf3504dr on 04/16/xi 01:56pm Well I finally got around to repairing the ladder. It went pretty smooth, I used my vice and a socket to press the star nuts into both ends of the tube that came off the motor home but I likewise had i that stayed attached to the motor home. I used a little grease on the within of the tube (on the 1 nonetheless fastened to the trunk) and used the socket and small ballpean hammer to bulldoze it abode. It all worked well and is better and then new.

Posted Past: tkcas01 on 04/xvi/11 03:45pm Thanks for the written report! I know I dreaded that job because I didn't know what I was doing or what I was getting into! Information technology's actually not that bad, merely takes a flake of fourth dimension and ingenuity! Glad you found my mail helpful.